First impressions can be misleading. Take the case of Suzanne Vega. When she emerged from the Greenwich Village folk scene with her debut record in 1985, she earned a reputation as being a shy, overly sensitive poetess who sang sotto voce songs of love's dark side.
To some fans and critics, uninformed or unwilling to accept
what she's become,
Vega remains that delicate waif folkie. The delightful truth of the
matter is that Suzanne Vega
has spent the last nine years growing in all sorts of unpredictable
directions.
Her musical tree, from folk roots, has branched out to include
Bealesque power pop,
synthesized mood pieces and even hip-hop (thanks to her encounter with
British rappers DNA
on "Tom's Diner"). On her last release, 99.9 F, her
experimental bent lured her into
dense aural landscapes bursting with industrial clangs, funky bass
loops and mad calliope
swoops. She even sang through a fuzzbox. A decidedly unfolky thing to
do.
Through all Vega's blossoming of creative talent, there has
remained one constant:
top-notch songwriting. Finely detailed and hard-hitting, her songs are
as potent for what they
leave unsaid. Inspired by heroes like Leonard Cohen and Lou Reed, she
is becoming a master
of this style of emotional suggestion.
On stage, Vega weaves a quiet spell, letting her plaintive,
almost vibratoless voice
glide above her percussive guitar playing. In between songs, she
displays a dry wit and dead-on
comic timing dispelling yet another myth about her that she has no
sense of humor.
Suzanne is currently writing new material and planning her
next record. We recently
spent an hour talking with this consummate performing songwriter about
her muses and methods
of songwriting.
Do you feel like songwriting is something that comes
naturally to you?
Yeah, I do. I always felt I had an ability to rhyme words,
even when I was very
young. When I would write poetry, that came the most easily to me -
the stuff with rhyme and
rhythm. So I do think it comes naturally, though it doesn't always
come easily.
Was there a point where you decided to become a
songwriter?
I was eleven when I first picked up the guitar. I tried to
write songs for about two
years before I wrote one that I was satisfied with. So I was fourteen
when the first one was
finished. But with some of the early ones, the structure's there, you
can kind of see it.
Do you do a lot of editing in your head before you start
to write the idea?
Lately I'll write out the general idea in longhand and then
eventually the whole thing gets
whittled down. So I wouldn't say that I edit it first, but I try to
make sure that it's at least a good idea
or something worth pursuing. Sometimes those initial longhand ideas
come out in rhyme and in meter,
but some of them don't. For example, "The Queen and the
Soldier", I had been thinking about
that song for months and months, and when I finally sat down to write
it came out in rhyme and in meter,
and in surprising ways. Ways that I hadn't expected. The rhymes would
suggest themselves to me,
that's the way it seemed. Whereas a song like "Rock In The
Pocket," I must have had about three or
four pages written out of the storyline before I finally boiled it down
to the three verses that it is.
The "Queen and the Soldier" has always been one
of my favorite songs of yours. Do
you recall what inspired it?
It's hard to say exactly. I know that I wanted to write a
song about a woman who was in
power and it's hard to find a symbol for someone like that, expecially
in America. So I chose the queen
to do that. There are details in ti that were influenced by things
that were happening around me at the
time, but I can't really tell you where the idea came from. The
original idea was that I had two queens
that were fighting each other and then I got rid of one of them because
it seemed like a stupid idea.
Once I got one of the queens out of there and put the battle outside
the castle, then that made more
sense. Then once I had the soldier come to the door, the whole thing
unfolded itself. It took me months
though to get to the point where the whole thing would clarify
itself.
Where did the line about swallowing "the secret burning
thread" come from?
That's the line that means a lot of different things to me,
because it's the one line that doesn't
make logical sense. People don't swallow threads. That comes from a
lot of different sources. One source
was that I had a cat who would chew the bottom off the curtains. She
did in fact swallow a thread and she
had to be put to sleep around that time. The other thing is that,
sometimes in your life, I think, you may
have a secret; and if you swallow it, if you keep it to yourself,
that's what it feels like. Or I used to think
of relationships between people as threads, so if there's one that's
secret and has a certain poisonous
character to it, then you keep it to yourself, you swallow it. I think
that's really the deeper meaning of
what I meant. She swallowed something that was hurting her. And I had
something like that in my own
life.
When one of your songs is first emerging, how much
control do you maintain?
Each one is different. The best ones are the ones where you
don't have any control, where
the thing just takes over and writes itself. The worst ones are the
ones where you have to sit and paste
and cut and look in the rhyming dictionary. They're the ones that sort
of die half way through and you
have to keep going over and breathe life into them.
Do you have any feelings about songs that are completed
quickly versus those that
may take years?
The weird thing is that the songs that take the longest are
sometimes the quickest ones
to write, because you can spend months, as I said before, thinking
about an idea and then when you
sit down to write it, it'll take an hour or two. "The Queen and the
Soldier," even though it took months
of thinking about it, took about three hours to write. Same thing
with "Luka." I took me months circling
that idea, then I wrote the whole thing in about two hours.
Tell me about how a character song like "Luka"
evolves.
Well, a character song is a tricky thing because, for me,
there's always a connection between
what I'm writing about and something that I'm feeling. So ti's never
abstract. I never just pluck somebody
off the street and say I'll write about that person. There's always
something about that situation that I'm
writing about that's true about my own life. Even if it's not the
exact same thing, it's close. So in the
case of "Luka," there was a boy whose name was Luka who lived
upstairs from me, who seemed like a
happy child. Not exactly happy, but he was not abused, as far as I
knew. But I would watch him and he
seemed sort of set apart from the other kids when he was playing, and I
remember thinking I would take
his character and use it for that particular idea. Write it from his
voice, because in that way I wanted the
song to stand up on its own, which I think the character songs do, if
you do them well. Because I wanted
to write from the point of view of a nine-year old boy, I was making it
as simple as possible. I was also
aware that the audience in the song is the neighbor. So it was kind of
like writing a play. First of all,
how do you introduce the character? You do that by saying, my name is
Luka, I live on the second floor.
And then you get the audience involved, saying, I live upstairs from
you. So you've seen me before.
You're incriminating the audience. You're pointing the finger without
reall doing it. You're unfolding this
story that can't really be told and you're involving the audience in it
and that was what I wanted to do.
Did you try different musical settings for
"Luka?"
No, not at all. The idea of making it sad by putting it in a
minor key, making it melancholy,
just seemed really sentimental and horrible to me. I wanted it to be a
song that was matter of fact as the
boy's voice would be. When I sing it alone on the acoustic guitar, I
think it does come out that way. I
think when we produced it for the album, it came out the way it did
because of the synthesizers. It gave
it a more uplifting effect than I intended (laughs).
I read that the idea for "Tired of Sleeping" was
something you found in a notebook from
eight years earlier. Is that typical of the way you
write?
Yeah, definitely. I think that life - my life anyway -
doesn't seem to go in any particular straight
line. It seems to go round in circles, so something that was important
to me when I was much younger is
still important to me. Things repeat themselves. That's how you know
if it's a good idea, if it's still relevant
years later.
Will you still work on more than one song at a
time?
Usually yeah, I have a batch in the oven (laughs). I prefer
to have a bunch going at once, that
way you don't get so hysterical if one comes out badly (laughs). You
don't have everything hanging on one
song. But my tactics have changed since when I was in my early
twenties and I didn't have a record deal,
I would be writing a song maybe once every other month. And now I find
that I go for long, dry periods
where I just don't want to think about anything, then I go through
periods where I'm writing a bunch a week.
So it's changed because my schedule has changed.
Do you ever play half-finished songs for
friends?
No (laughs). I'm really superstitious about that. I just
feel like you lose it; if you don't catch it
while it's still struggling, then you kind of lose something in it.
And people can't always see that it's not
finished and they'll say something that kills the whole thing. I would
prefer to finish it. I have enough
trouble singing them when they're brand new and they are finished.
Usually I feel a sort of cringing feeling.
Are there certain tests that a song has to pass before
you'll consider it finished?
If I still like it the next morning, I really think about the
subject matter a lot, because to me, you
have to really be careful about writing about things that are trendy.
Humor doesn't seem to sit well in my
songs, for example. Something that I think is funny doesn't wear well.
So I try to look at it from different
angles and the different moods I might be in. And I've learned over
the years that it's better to have some
kind of formal structure rather than thinking you're being inventive
and deciding to do away with the melody
all together, for example. I think in my early twenties I thought I
was being clever by saying I don't need to
write with a melody or I don't need to write with this or that, but
it's better to stick to some kind of structure.
To have a chorus, to have a melody, to have rhymes. Formal
guidelines.
You mentioned humor. I've read other interviews with
you where you said you felt like
sometimes people missed the humor in your songs. Can you explain
that?
I guess the first thing that comes to mind is a song like
"Small Blue Thing," which to me had a
humorous element, and was meant to be more playful than it's been
interpreted. It was meant to be almost
like a cartoon, like a question that you'd ask a child. "If you were
to describe how you felt, what would
you be like?" Or "If you were a small blue thing, what would you be?"
That to me isn't side-splitting funny,
but it has an element of whimsy that some people don't look at. I have
to say that most of the songs that
I wrote as overtly angry, bitter songs don't wear well with me. Most
of them I don't sing anymore, wheras
the really sad ones seem to always go very well (laughs), for me, I
don't know why that is. The really sad
ones like "The Queen and the Soldier" and "Cracking" are
the ones that people really respond to.
You once said that you felt like the secret of life was
in A minor.
(Laughs). It seemed that way for a long time and that was
something from even when I was
a child. It just seemed that the really true songs seemed to be all
really sad and in that particular key.
Were you conscious from the beginning about the kinds of
words and phrases you use in
your songs? They're very identifiable - those short, hard-sounding
words.
It was a decision I made in my twenties. I'd been writing
songs for about six or seven years at
that point. I don't know why I decided to adapt that particular way of
writing, but I think it's because I felt
that a lot of songs were really romantic and I wanted to do something
different that was more urban. That's
one reason. Those shorter phrases seemed to hit harder. They were
more satisfying to sing. But the other
thing that I've discovered is that I think I tend to sing in short
phrases because I've had asthma for a long
time and couldn't really breathe and hold the long notes. I only
discovered that I had that a few years ago.
So I developed my writing style to accommodate my voice unconsciously.
I didn't intend to do it, I was just
trying to write like a good writer, to the point and punchy, in words
that were vivid.
Were there any authors that influenced your writing
style?
John Steinbeck was someone who wrote in that simple style. I
started to read poetry. I was
reading Sylvia Plath, and I just really like the way she writes,
because it's always startling and always interesting
and she tends to use those short phrases with uncomfortable
images.
One of my favorites from your last record was "In
Liverpool." How did that song come about?
That was a really odd one. That was one I wasn't sure would
fly, because it's bits and pieces,
it's a mood really and a fantasy. It came about because I was on tour
and I was in Liverpool and I was lying
on the bed of the hotel we were staying in. And I was trying to take a
nap and there was this enormous clamoring
going on across the street. We were staying across the street from a
cathedral. I started to think about one of
my first boyfriends, who was from Liverpool. That started to put me in
the mood of - well, because I read a lot,
it put me in the mood of the books like "The Hunchback of Notre Dame,"
and things that had to do with bells,
and the ringing of bells. I was thinking about old loves, so there was
this sort of nostalgic feeling to the whole
afternoon. So I took the moments that made sense and put them
altogether in the song.
Did you purposely leave "Blood Makes Noise"
open-ended?
Yes, I did, because it's a song about a moment. It's not a
song about an issue. People want to say,
wll that's her AIDS song. It's a song about fear and it's a song about
the fear of disclosing information, which
a lot of the songs are about. It's a song that I can't entirely
explain myself, because the attitude towards the
doctor is extremely sarcastic and ironic. Here's someone who's an
authority who's trying to help you and you're
not being helpful. It has a sort of mocking tone to it.
I've heard you comment that there's a lot in your lyrics
that you don't understand?
Yeah, some of it is like that because it comes to me and then
I write it down. It's like getting a
message on a telephone. Sometimes it comes in clearly and sometimes it
doesn't. sometimes you don't understand
all the bits. That's what I mean by thst. It's like a dream, where
sometimes you don't quite understand it. Songs
are in that world.
You've talked in the past about some pretty specific
musical influences. Have you ever used
a song by another artist as a springboard for one of your
own?
Yes, mostly Lou Reed songs. I guess "I'm Waiting for My
Man," I used when I was thinking about
"Men in a War." And it's pretty clear. If you listen to it
musically, you can tell. The production didn't relfect
as much of it as I would've liked maybe at that time, but the musical
structure came from that.
Can you think of some of your favorite songs by other
artists?
Yeah, well there's "It's All Right, Ma" by Bob Dylan,
which I love and I got to sing it at The Bottom
Line a few weeks ago and that was just a great feeling. "Famous
Blue Raincoat" by Leonard Cohen. He's
got one called "Avalanche" that I love, too. There's a lot that
he's written that I really like. There's a bunch
by Laura Nyro and a couple of Rickie Lee Jones', especially the
Pirates album.
Did the course your song "Tom's Diner" took
surprise you?
Well, yeah, because it was such a small idea that became such
a big thing. It was like a whimsical
thing. I was thinking of my friend Brian and I was thinking of writing
through his eyes and I sort of had this tune
in my head, then I put the whole thing down. It became sort of a
signature thing.
Was that an actual place?
Yeah, there's a place called Tom's Restaurant on 112th Street
and Broadway, right near the Cathedral
of St. John the Divine. Everyone from school would go there and eat.
There's nothing really special about it.
It's a very ordinary place, which is why I liked it.
After the DNA rap version of that song, did you fell
like it set you free as an artist to experiment?
Yeah, I think it was something I would've done eventually
anyway. The DNA version of "Tom's Diner"
was not something I woul've done myself, but I liked it when I heard
it. I thought it was funny. And it did make
me feel more free, but as I say, I think I would've eventually gotten
there, because I was starting to feel very
hemmed in by the production techniques we were using.
Your singing style is instantly recognizable. How did
you develop it?
Mostly I took what I liked. When I was a kid, the voices I
loved were voices like Astrud Gilberto.
And I didn't like the adult ways of singing, I didn't like the vibrato
- that didn't mean anything to me. I preferred
voices that were very direct. And I liked Lou Reed's voice. Lotte
Lenya's voice, the voices that are straightforward.
So that's what I tried to do. I just tried to make my voice come out
in the simplest way possible, with no pretending
that I'm a fine singer or anything. I wasn't interested in being a
fine singer, I didn't care about that.
Did you decide to mix in spoken word with
melody?
Well, melody is something that I've had to work on very hard,
because the thing that comes naturally
to me is rhythm and rhyme in the songwriting. Melody is something I've
had to really sit down and consciously
work on. To figure out how a melody develops. You can't just repeat
something over and over again. A melody
is its own idea, but I didn't know that. So I mixed in spoken words,
because I thought I was being experimental.
Actually it was kind of a weakness of mine. Melody is my weakness,
rhythm and rhyme ar my strengths.
What do you do to develop you melodic
sense?
If I'm listening to a classical piece I'll try to be aware of
what the melodic line is, because I have a
hard time remembering melodies or singing them. So sometimes I'll just
try to make myself think of a melody. if
I'm listening to classical or jazz, I think, where is the melody, how
does it deviate? Or when I'm writing, now
that I'm more aware, I try to put in some variation. Instead of
repeating this phrase here, maybe I should take
it up higher, maybe I should go lower. Or I listen to Elvis Costello,
who seems to have endless variations and
all kinds of melodies, and I'll follow his thinking. It's the same way
I do if I'm reading John Steinbeck - you just
don't read it for the story, yo get into the language. You take the
sentences apart to see what he's done and how
he's done it. So I try and do that a little bit with people like Elvis
Costello, who seems to have a natural gift.
"When Heroes Go Down" and "In Liverpool" have an Elvis
Costello sound them.
Especially "When Heroes Go Down." I was looking for
something that was melodic, short
and punchy, and I was thinking of Elvis Costello. "In
Liverpool" was a mixture. I was tying to teach myself
how to play "Almost Blue" (a Costello song). That's where the
verses came from. Then the chorus was just
something else. And I jammed the two things together. At first I
thought maybe it was really corny or it had a
feeling like a campfire song (laughs), but then I realized that it
worked. Another example of that is I was trying to
teach myself how to play the Chrissie Hynde song "Kid." And I
realized that the reason her songs sound
classic is because she uses those chords that you hear from all the 50s
songs. They are songs that you would
sing around the campfire, but because of the production, it's much
cooler than that. But there's still a classic
element to what she does because of those chords. That made me not
afraid to use plain,simple chords like
E and A and B7, chords that I felt like everybody used.
Is it more important that those efforts to learn someone
else's song lead you to create one of
your own, or do you actually ever get around to working that song into
your repertoire?
(Laughs) In the case of "Almost Blue,"I just stopped
when I got the other idea. I did learn how
to play "Kid"and I did play it in my band, but I found for me to
cover a Chrissie Hynde song, it didn't help
anything. For a woman to sing another woman's song, unless she can
really put a twist on it, it's sometimes not
as effective. Whereas if I sing an Elvis Costello song or a Bob Dylan
song, I can give it a different meaning.
Do you ever feel like your audience wants to restrict
you to their version of who you are?
Yeah, certainly, all the time. But on the other hand, my
audience seems to change constantly. In
1985, it was like, oh she's a folkie. Then in 1987, I suddenly was
accused of having all kinds of yuppie CD-buying
audiences, which I thought was kind of odd. Things change, and I find
the audience changes. The audience gets
younger sometimes. The last record attracted al lot of 12-year old
girls coming to the shows. So the audiences
change. I think to some degree, I have been somewhat misinterpreted,
but I'm not complaining about it. I'm just
saying that I'm difficult to categorize. I look a certain way, but I'm
not that way. I may look like a sort of Irish maiden,
but I grew up in New York City under very unusual circumstances, so I'm
not what I appear to be. so some people
will stick with me in the long run, and other people will find other
people. That's just the way it is.
Do you see yourself as an artist like Joe Jackson or
David Bowie, and who tries different musical
styles from record to record?
Probably, because I think that the strength of what I do is
in the words. The musical setting will
always change, because I always thought of myself as a songwriter. The
production aspects are new to me, so
they're constantly changing. I'm always trying to find the best
production for the particular song. Since I write
wildly different kinds of songs, the production's not always going to
be the same, which unfortunately means in
the real world, you can't always use it for the same thing. People
like to use music, like for backgrounds at parties
(laughs), or soothing themselves to sleep, or dancing to, so therefore
my music will never fit into one particular
use. The first two records were heard a lot in restaurants and no one
plays 99.9 F in any restaurants that I've
heard (laughs). You know what I'm saying?
Do you feel a pressure to outdo yourself, after 99.9
F?
No, I knew when we were oding it that it was something
unusual and something that would probably
not be repeated. Just because of the kind of energy that was happening
at the time. It would be very stupid
for me to do something like - "Blood Makes More Noise." Then I
think I would start to lose my identity.
So the next album probably won't be as radical, or perceived as
radical. But I don't really care about that. I'm
not trying to explode my consciousness here.
Any final words to songwriters?
Yeah, keep going. Don't listen to anyone's advice. Just do
what you feel is right and develop your
own style. Go with your strengths and be aware of your weaknesses, but
don't try and be like someone else.
Don't be intimidated to knock your heroes down. Don't think oh, I'll
never write as good as that. Just go and
do it. It'll all follow. Remember, the things that make you go, ugh,
that's horrible, or no one will like this - those
are the things that make you unique and make you interesting. Your
friends may turn around and say, God what
a freak. But you yourself, that's the thing that makes you unique, and
that's what you've got to hold onto.
For more information on The Performing Songwriter Magazine, check out their website!
Submitted by Paul Murphy
VegaNet@aol.com